Best deepest shinnying wax. What do you suggest?

[Romaz]

Lets hear it…

[J.D.]

Pinnacle Souveran

[HoldenCaulfield04]

On Tiag, I would vote for a sealant in place of a wax.

[e46TiAg]

On Tiag, I would vote for a sealant in place of a wax.
Can you elaborate on that please? :confused: I too have a silver car, and I am planning to use Meguiar Gold Class to wax my car whenever I have a chance.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/rodi_1996_8675342

[Bythehour]

Meg's gold is decent stuff. It has good endurance for people who don't wax regularly. I've had some problems with Gold muting paint over time. You'd be well advised to strip it once a year (i.e., do a full wash/clay/polish).

Pinnacle Souv is, IMO, overrated. It is good stuff, but it ain't worth $80 a jar. Souveran is especially good at bringing out depth and gloss in darker cars, so it may be worth it if you have a Jet Black or Monaco Blue ride.

For lighter colours, especially silver, I like P21S. It is very easy to apply and remove, and it doesn't mute the paint. The big problem with P21S is that it has no durability (ok, maybe 2 weeks, tops).

If you're not going to wax once a month (more like twice a year), I'd suggest going with Collinite 476 (paste) or 845 (liquid). This stuff is rock solid protection. It will go for four or five months, even in the winter. Be careful though, it is a pain to remove if you put on too much.

[christyles]

Meg's gold is decent stuff. It has good endurance for people who don't wax regularly. I've had some problems with Gold muting paint over time. You'd be well advised to strip it once a year (i.e., do a full wash/clay/polish).

Pinnacle Souv is, IMO, overrated. It is good stuff, but it ain't worth $80 a jar. Souveran is especially good at bringing out depth and gloss in darker cars, so it may be worth it if you have a Jet Black or Monaco Blue ride.

For lighter colours, especially silver, I like P21S. It is very easy to apply and remove, and it doesn't mute the paint. The big problem with P21S is that it has no durability (ok, maybe 2 weeks, tops).

If you're not going to wax once a month (more like twice a year), I'd suggest going with Collinite 476 (paste) or 845 (liquid). This stuff is rock solid protection. It will go for four or five months, even in the winter. Be careful though, it is a pain to remove if you put on too much.
I disagree with Pinnacle Souv being overrated. But like many other products on the market each has their strengths and weaknesses and yes... Pinn.Souv. is best on darker coloured cars not so much TiAg.

I personally haven't used Collinite but have heard good reviews from detailing colleagues.

Meguiars 16 is also not bad. Unfortunately, the smell is nauseating.

[Bythehour]

I disagree with Pinnacle Souv being overrated. But like many other products on the market each has their strengths and weaknesses and yes... Pinn.Souv. is best on darker coloured cars not so much TiAg.

I personally haven't used Collinite but have heard good reviews from detailing colleagues.

Meguiars 16 is also not bad. Unfortunately, the smell is nauseating.

Touche! :D

I don't mean to knock Souveran (I use it myself.) I just don't think that it's work $X more than, well, a lot of other waxes.

Never tried #16. I know it has a rep for being crazy durable. (Eshine has it in stock now, btw) But, I've also heard that it can be a beast to take off.


Anyhoo, as I'm sure Chris will confirm, it ain't the wax that makes the car shine. The wax just acts as a protectant/sealant. For a real shine, you need to prep the surface properly. Clay, defect correction and polish...a good four to six hour job....

[christyles]

Touche! :D

I don't mean to knock Souveran (I use it myself.) I just don't think that it's work $X more than, well, a lot of other waxes.

Never tried #16. I know it has a rep for being crazy durable. (Eshine has it in stock now, btw) But, I've also heard that it can be a beast to take off.


Anyhoo, as I'm sure Chris will confirm, it ain't the wax that makes the car shine. The wax just acts as a protectant/sealant. For a real shine, you need to prep the surface properly. Clay, defect correction and polish...a good four to six hour job....
#16 can be a beast to remove like Klasse. :thumbsdow But yes... crazy durable is hitting the nail with a hammer. Also, leaves little wax-powdery residue when removing.

Pinn.Souveran is pricey no doubt, but I can use it for a little more than a season with the amount of cars I go through.

And definetly, it doesn't matter what wax you use, if your prepping for the wax isn't correct, you will not get the ultimate shine.

(I will start a new thread as to how I get the shine with the Premier Touch, and a little review on some waxes I've used.)

[Bythehour]

(I will start a new thread as to how I get the shine with the Premier Touch, and a little review on some waxes I've used.)

Not going to give away all your trade secrets, are you? :D

[christyles]

Not going to give away all your trade secrets, are you? :D
hahaha... even if I did, auto detailing is not a job. It's an art. I see things in paint others didn't even know was there.

With all the marketing of detailing products of "all in one" cleaner/polish/wax, it takes time to find the right combination of a compound, polish, wax or sealant, proper pads, speed, and pressure on the polisher. Not to mention, the tedious task of claying, how hard to press, what to use to keep the surface lubricated and how often to clean the clay.

From my past experience, some have tried to save themselves the money from bringing their cars to get detailed, and did it themselves and ended up burning their paint or inflicting more scratches. Few were somewhat successful. And some like dirty cars or just an "ok" shine and the rest know what to expect when they pay a few hundred bucks for the Premier Touch.

$99 for a full inside out detailing... It's funny when ever I see that advertised.

[audiophilia]

Souveron as handled by Chris is the only stuff that touches my car.

I don't know why folks rate Klasse. The three cars I've seen it on (and applied by people who know what they are doing), looks like crap. IMO.

Dull as dishwater.

[Bythehour]

$99 for a full inside out detailing... It's funny when ever I see that advertised.

You mean the "detail while U shop" deal at Loblaw's? :D

What do you think of the Zymol "premier" line (e.g., Vintage?) I've never tried it (can't justify the $).

I've just ordered Einszett polish twins to try out. Any advice?

[HoldenCaulfield04]

Souveron as handled by Chris is the only stuff that touches my car.

I don't know why folks rate Klasse. The three cars I've seen it on (and applied by people who know what they are doing), looks like crap. IMO.

Dull as dishwater.

Carnauba has a glow to it that isn't really matched by any form of sealant. Klasse, though, is one of the best. I usually put a layer of KAIO underneath a nuba layer.

[christyles]

You mean the "detail while U shop" deal at Loblaw's? :D

What do you think of the Zymol "premier" line (e.g., Vintage?) I've never tried it (can't justify the $).

I've just ordered Einszett polish twins to try out. Any advice?
ya.. no doubt.

I have yet to try the Zymol premier line... but like you said, how do you justify the $. Sometimes I can hardly justify the Pinnacle Souv but yet, it's made its way into my process and quite effectively might I add.

Let me know how Einszett is...

[Bythehour]

Carnauba has a glow to it that isn't really matched by any form of sealant. Klasse, though, is one of the best. I usually put a layer of KAIO underneath a nuba layer.



I remember reading somewhere that nuba has a complex/random molecular structure while sealant has a uniform molecular structure (because it is engineered). (I'm probably saying this wrong, so give me a break. I'll try to find the paper.)

The uniform structure of sealant allows it to form a stronger surface bond, but at the cost of one-dimensional gloss and a lack of depth.

Whatever, I just use whatever smells good....

[christyles]

Whatever, I just use whatever smells good....+1... Pinnacle = coconuts.

[0770]

i have alpine white and am considering waxing the car and would like it to glow like jewel.

any recommendation on wax/polish/claybar for a novice DIYer?

i know white is hard to make shine but any recommendation would be great.

i plan to claybar so do i still need to polish? seal/glaze?

thanks in advance for the input.
O

[Bythehour]

i have alpine white and am considering waxing the car and would like it to glow like jewel.

any recommendation on wax/polish/claybar for a novice DIYer?

i know white is hard to make shine but any recommendation would be great.

i plan to claybar so do i still need to polish? seal/glaze?

thanks in advance for the input.
O

Yes, you need to do all three steps. The claybar simply removes surface contaminants. This is the stuff that you feel if you run your fingers over the dry paint surface. (Or, you can use a clean sandwich bag. You should literally hear the crackling from the bumps.) When you clay, remember to keep the surface lubricated. Don't rub the clay on dry paint.

Polishing, if done properly, is to correct swirls and minor scratches in the paint. This is a key step in the prep process. This is what makes the paint shine.

Wax or sealant simply seals in the paint for protection. Yes, there is some element of shine from the wax. But, if you don't prep well, you're just going to seal in the uglies and the shine will not last.

For Alpine White, I like P21S. It goes on and comes off wet, and it has a nice sheen.

[ExCrEmAn]

does anyone can recommend some web site for buying those wax and polishing product like Einszett polish,P21S or some good product? thank you

[0770]

Thx Bythehour!

this may be a silly question, but if i plan to polish/swirl remove, do i need to clay before hand or will it be a waste of effort/time?

i am thinking yes because the contaminants may just scratch the paint more but at the same time, i think it would be waste of time because the polish actually removes a layer of paint and makes more scratches.

I just don't know what the proper steps are and what is needed/not needed.

ie don't want to clay and polish if all i need one of them.

Thanks!
O

[Bythehour]

Thx Bythehour!

this may be a silly question, but if i plan to polish/swirl remove, do i need to clay before hand or will it be a waste of effort/time?

i am thinking yes because the contaminants may just scratch the paint more but at the same time, i think it would be waste of time because the polish actually removes a layer of paint and makes more scratches.

I just don't know what the proper steps are and what is needed/not needed.

ie don't want to clay and polish if all i need one of them.

Thanks!
O


LOL! You are going down a slippery slope my friend! If you don't have the time or tools to do it right, you would be better off hiring Chris to do the detail for you....


If you do want to DIY (and it is very satisfying, IMO):

Way back in the day, no one clayed. Now, every detailer I know clays. It doesn't take long (I can do my car in 10 minutes, but then again, I try to keep it pretty clean). You don't HAVE to clay, but you should. Polishing will not necessarily get rid of the surface contaminants and, even if your polisher manages to loosen the grit, do you really want to be polishing with grit on your pad?

Here's a time-saving tip: After you wash your car (with auto soap, not dish detergent) don't bother drying it off. Go right ahead and clay the car, spritzing your clay lube when/where needed. Of course, make sure that your clay will withstand water exposure. Some clays disintegrate with water. I've used Mother's and Riccardo (from eshine.ca) without problems.

Polishing by hand is not easy. You better be in shape. I never did get the hang of it, so I ended by a random orb machine last year. If you are just starting out, there's no way that you should be taking off paint (or clearcoat). Your polishing pad and liquid should not be that aggressive. (As a general rule, always start with the mildest combination of pad/polish and only escalate if you can't get results.) If you can spare the $$$, invest in a random orbital. You will get quick results, and the risk of damaging paint is quite low.

If you are not inclined to do all this work, maybe you can take a shortcut: filler wax.

Stuff like Turtle Wax Platinum and other off the shelf products is typically filler wax, as opposed to pure wax. Cleaner wax has "fillers" in the product, which fill in hairline scratches and other imperfections. This is a purely cosmetic solution. The scratches and swirls and still there, and they will reveal themselves again once the wax wears off. But, it is a short term solution....

[christyles]

Thx Bythehour!

this may be a silly question, but if i plan to polish/swirl remove, do i need to clay before hand or will it be a waste of effort/time?

i am thinking yes because the contaminants may just scratch the paint more but at the same time, i think it would be waste of time because the polish actually removes a layer of paint and makes more scratches.

I just don't know what the proper steps are and what is needed/not needed.

ie don't want to clay and polish if all i need one of them.

Thanks!
O
Hi O,

Detailing steps aren't a waste of time, they each have a purpose in order to make the next step more effective.



i think it would be waste of time because the polish actually removes a layer of paint and makes more scratches.


Polish does not remove a layer of paint. unless you stood there for a while in the same spot with a rotary polisher through force of friction, the surface area will heat up. -> melts clearcoat->melts paint and burns through all the layers.
Compound will burn through even faster. Some grades are very abrasive and some are mild.

If you have the patience to do the steps properly, it can be therapeutic and of course make your ride look very nice.

[0770]

Thanks for the hings bythehour!

i have used Chris before and his work was phenomenal. But I would like to try this for myself as it is very satisfying as you have pointed out.

i am about to put my order in at eshine for the follwoing:
- porter cable swirl buster kit
- 1x orange pad
- 1x white pad
- 1x black pad
- snappy clean foam pad cleaner
- Poorboy's 1 Swirl Remover
- Poorboy's 2 Swirl Remover
- Poorboy's 3 Swirl Remover
- Klasse AIO
- Zymol Creame Wax
- Zymol HD Cleanse
- Zymol Clear Auto Bathe (love the smell of Zymol products)
- Meguiar's Clay Bar
- Clay Lubricant (worried Meguiars will disinterate with water?) and
- Zymol Leather conditioner

my plan of attack (please correct me if i am wrong with steps)
1. wash car
2. clay bar car
3. rinse/wash car again
4. swirl remove process (less aggressive to more aggressive if needed)
5. rinse/wash car again
6. Klasse AIO as sealant protector
7. HD Cleanse?? (Zymol recommends i use this product before their wax)
8. Zymol Wax
9. enjoy the hard work

my question is with regards to Klasse? is it a sealant/glaze..should i use an additional product?

also, if i use HD cleanse, will it just strip away the Klasse AIO (so why bother doing it?) and/or do i use HD cleanse before AIO, then but wax on top of AIO (will it bond properly?

Thanks for the helps!
looking forward to spending a day or two on this!
Otto

[QUOTE=Bythehour]LOL! You are going down a slippery slope my friend! If you don't have the time or tools to do it right, you would be better off hiring Chris to do the detail for you....


If you do want to DIY (and it is very satisfying, IMO):QUOTE]

[christyles]

0770,

I don't believe in multi-step "swirl removers".

Not to discourage you, but you can create swirls regardless of what compound you use, what pad you use, how much pressure you are applying on the polisher to the paint, what speed you have your polisher running at and how fast your moving polisher over the paint.

If you like, I will save you a wack of cash and give you a list of what you need, where to get it and how to polish with a rotary.

A quick tidbit of my arsenal:
Mothers clay
mild compound
aggressive compound
polish
wax

Pads:
wool pad for heavy cutting
foam pad for heavy cutting
foam pad for medium cutting
foam pad for light cutting
foam pad for hi-speed polishing

Whatever route you go... practice on an inconspicuous area first like a lower panel of your door where any errors like additional swirls you put into the paint are less visible. Don't practice on bumpers... they are plastic and factors are different when buffing plastic vs. metal.

[fayraree]

wow I can't wait for June 1.

[Bythehour]

Haha, for all that loot, it'd be cheaper hiring Chris! :D

You don't need to wash after every step, but that's up to you.

I've never used AIO, but I understand that is a chemical polish (chemically removes old wax, surface oxidation, etc). Using the HD and AIO would be redundant.

I would recommend the Riccardo clay over the Meguair's stuff. It is more cost effective and, I find, easier to work with. Also, I've used the Riccardo stuff for two years now with a diluted wash/water solution as lube without problems....

+1 on what Chris said about creating swirls. That's why I'd be wary of picking up a rotary and/or a wool pad.

I think that your pad selection is good, although you may want to pick up at least two of the orange and white pads (in case you need to try a different product and don't have time to wash/clean). Maybe you should count on one pad for each of your products.

You can go with the black finishing pad, but I've only used mine twice. Frankly, I find that most LSP are easier to apply by hand. I just stock up on the small foad applicators now.

Have you considered the UDM or the Flex? I have the UDM (works well; even after dropping it once/twice). I would consider the Flex now if I were in the market. More power.

[christyles]

Haha, for all that loot, it'd be cheaper hiring Chris! :D

You don't need to wash after every step, but that's up to you.

I've never used AIO, but I understand that is a chemical polish (chemically removes old wax, surface oxidation, etc). Using the HD and AIO would be redundant.

I would recommend the Riccardo clay over the Meguair's stuff. It is more cost effective and, I find, easier to work with. Also, I've used the Riccardo stuff for two years now with a diluted wash/water solution as lube without problems....

+1 on what Chris said about creating swirls. That's why I'd be wary of picking up a rotary and/or a wool pad.

I think that your pad selection is good, although you may want to pick up at least two of the orange and white pads (in case you need to try a different product and don't have time to wash/clean). Maybe you should count on one pad for each of your products.

You can go with the black finishing pad, but I've only used mine twice. Frankly, I find that most LSP are easier to apply by hand. I just stock up on the small foad applicators now.

Have you considered the UDM or the Flex? I have the UDM (works well; even after dropping it once/twice). I would consider the Flex now if I were in the market. More power.
Hahah... thanks for the vote of confidence bythehour... maybe you should start working for Premier... :rolleyes:

Pressure washing (no soaping) after every step is good practice especially when claying. Due to the fact that grit and/or other contaminants could still be sitting there after claying. But once you're confident in your skills, you can omit this step.

You can never have enough foam applicators.